Query on odd dimension site

[gautham]

I found a site (Old house to be demolished) which is supposedly 30-50. But it isnt actually 30-50. Its a south facing one and dimension is odd. I am not a big believer in vastu. But I want to know if this dimension is considered very odd and if there could be any drawbacks. ( One of the agents told its round shaped or something and advised me against buying it. I dont know if it was a genuine advice because I didn't see this site thru him.). Please find attached site picture. Front side 40, Right side 40.6, Left side 34. Back side is where the odd dimension is. The line is not straight. I have the following queries.
1. Is this considered a bad dimension and hence should be avoided?
2. What would be the total site dimension?. The seller says 1500 something. But as per my calculation its 1492. ( 40*34) + (6.6*40)/2

site.jpg (17.2 KiB) Viewed 14799 times

Appreciate any help on this

[Visualizer]

There is nothing bad however odd size sites are not preferred due to below reasons.

Logical Reasons
__________________
1. The usable area goes down in odd shaped plots compared to truly rectilinear plot of same area.
So in case of trapezoidal plots you are effectively paying for land which you wont be able to use.

If you go for any conventional house design at best usable area is 40x34 = 1360 sq feet
and you need to remove mandatory offsets on East , West and South as well so that leaves plinth area of 980 sq feet.
From your line diagram it is not clear if the east and west side are truly parallel or not.
If suppose these two sides are not parallel then your usable area will go down further.

Only option would be to sit with an architect and design how the tapered ends of land can be best used in design.
So think how will you use the tapered area in north east suppose if you fancy having an open backyard im your home this can be utilised as open space

2. About the question on actual area of the site:

Before finalizing deal for any site call a surveyor they use laser based survey instruments and give correct dimension up to mm.

Survey charges should be between 3000 to 10000 Rs. In many cases specifically in pvt layouts site dimensions don't match dimension on paper map for fixing dimension also measure road in front and 3 side plots and access roads to them as well so you know for sure your site is measured correctly.

3. Southern Sun is harsh in tropical climate in northern hemisphere. In an south facing plot the bigger windows openings will come towards south and in design you need to consider protection from harsh sun.
Northern and Eastern lights are preferable.
If site is big you can leave area towards East for garden so that you can maximise ventilation from east.

Cultural Factors
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Sale value also depends on how good is the plot is as per vastu.
One may or may not believe in vastushastra however it is one factor to fix the price /resale value.

As per vastushastra

1.South facing direction is not preferred for residential purpose however it is considered good for commercial buildings.

2. In case of trapezoidal plots, plot towards smaller side towards road is called Gomukhi ( snout tapered in front like cow) and is considered auspicious. Plots where road facing end is broad is called Singh-mukhi.
Singh mukhi plots are considered inauspicious.

From the line diagram this plot is Gomukhi so passes this criteria.


3. Direction of taper: Tapering towards north west is considered bad and towards north east is good.

So on this count also it passes.

[gautham]

Thank you so such Visualizier. Thats a very useful information. Very impressed with the knowledge you have. You have been of great help. I cant than you enough. If you dont mind, I have a couple of up questions. Would appreciate any input.
1. East and west are parallel. Only the backside is not. I plan to utilize the backside as an open area. We are a small family of 3. My requirement is hall, kitchen, 1 bed room and parking ( 1 large car and 1 hatchback ) in the ground floor and 2 bed rooms in the first floor. ( Duplex. Not for rent). Is it asking for too much in such a site?. My guess is, its doable. I haven seen people building good duplex even on a 30-40. But I am not sure. Could you throw some light?
3. I know there is no right or wrong answer for this. The owner is asking a premium of about 10%. Is it worth paying it, considering its a south facing and odd dimension?. ( Actually he put the add more than an year ago. Its still not sold. When I check with the neighbors, they say its because of the price). The location is good and neighbors are decent. But I dont want to overpay even though I can afford. The problem is that, there are hardly any decent options if one is searching in old Bangalore areas. So in a dilemma whether to overpay or keep searching forever.

Thanks again

[tvsh]

The site is protruded in the north east direction. This is considered good as per vastu. Hence the expectation of higher price by the owner and more over he may not be in a hurry. Hence quoting a higher price. South facing sites are the least preferred and hence are sold at a discount to the prevailing market rates. Everything depends on how you negotiate. East and Western sides are parallel, the dimensions are (34+40.6/2) * 40 =1492 sq feet. This will be mentioned in the sale deed.

[Visualizer]

(1) About using the backside as open garden check the condition of site if it receives direct sunlight or not.
If suppose area is not getting direct sunlight for 6 hours you can't have a garden but can only use as a courtyard.

(2) Looks doable easily

(3) The premium should be fixed as per location of the site , I see no point in paying 10% just for taper in north east.
In fact you should seek a discount for the same reason. Of course it all depends on how badly owner wants to sell.

[gautham]

thanks a lot tvsh, Visualizer
Visualizer,
You are right. But these owners wont budge at all. I understand that it depends on how badly they want to sell. (This particular owner is not in a hurry. ( Its been there for sale for more than an year). But I got to know hes looking dispose off by this year end.) . In fact most of the sellers are like this only. They have a price in mind and wait forever. They dont know the simple math of opportunity cost.
The problem is, there arent too many good properties inside the city. Anyways lets see how it goes.

[gautham]

Hi Visualizer . Sorry to ask again. I have one more doubt. While I am negotiating this house, I found a fairly new livable house built on about 2210 land area. Advantage is that, no headache of demolishing and building again. The total cost may be more or less the same ( since i have to construct in the other one). Plus am getting a much bigger land. But main concern is that, the overall design and quality is not that great. So sometimes I feel it would be better to construct from scratch. In this context, I wanted get a fair idea on the total cost of construction. You have already answered in a different query. But this time i will be more specific.
Lets say we leave some space out to make the site even. Then we are left with 1360 sq feet. Then we have to remove the mandatory area. So it comes to about 1000 sq ft. Spec is 1 bedroom, hall, kitchen on ground floor and 2 bed room in 1st floor. In your opinion, what would be the total end to end cost ( assuming premium materials)?. I mean including woodwork etc. And also the time taken to build. Can we assume it will take at least 1 year if not more. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

[Visualizer]

Unless you have plan and design in place it is hard to predict the costs however I am trying.

Disclaimer this is a layman's budget estimate you should take it from couple of civil engineers or/and architects.

EDIT: As post became very long putting summary first.

Summary

(A) Basic good quality 2000 Sq ft ( 1000 plinth + 1 floor) : 46-50L overall ,
40 L + another 6-10L for other expenses ( Approvals + Soil test + Sump + Parapet + boundary wall + BESCOM + BWSSB + woodwork + civil engineer / structural engg fees.+ bribes)

(B) Premium human interfaces ( switches , paint , better tiles, windows ) 55 - 60 L

(C) Premium 78 - 80 L

(D) Super premium ~1 cr - no limit

Detailed calculation ]


You need to first define what is premium for you different people have different opinions.

Example: For me premium construction means lesser plinth and leave out costly real estate for garden . Exposed brick + concrete or sized stone like natural finish and lot of sunlight and ventilation through skylights, open roofs , 6'-8' high bay windows and parking for at-least 2 cars instead of boxy construction. For this kind of design premium-ness you need to necessarily hire a good architect.

Whereas for lot of other people premium-ness comes from Italian marble, costlier granite and
teak-wood , costly sanitary-ware etc and with house with larger covered area.

Mostly when people say premium they generally mean flooring , bathrooms , electrical switches.

First for First Civil work part :

Foundation and basements are costly and cost decreases for upper floors.
If you are unlucky and soil bearing capacity is poor then foundation needs to be deeper and tie beams and footings stronger and cost increases exponentially.

For example in my case soil bearing capacity was low and I wanted a basement , my plinth area is 1400 sq ft and close to 20+L are already gone in foundation and basement but roof slab for basement is not yet done.

So assuming your construction is simple ( no basement , no RCC retaining wall , Soil bearing capacity good, no other complications) and 2000 sq feet of constructed area in ground + 1 floor

In civil work premium material does not alter cost too much in fact many times primary steel such as SAIL/ Vizag/ JSW could work out cheaper then many secondary steel brands and brand of cement does not make any difference. The most premium civil material is river sand but most constructions are now done with M-Sand and for plastering you can use slag. I stayed away from river sand due to environmental concerns.

It should cost you approx 2000 x 2000 = 40 L in normal construction with normal finish ( if any complications add 10- 15 L more)

Adding Premium finishes :

1. Add 2 L for each bathroom instead of basic Cera/Perryware/hindware kind of fittings you are going for brands such as Toto and costlier tiles. Assuming you need 4 bathrooms in your 3 BR home add 8L.

2. Flooring:
Wood ( bamboo wood /Acacia/Engineered hard wood with 4mm wood layer ) : 400 -450/- per sq feet
Basic Italian Marble : 400 - 500/-
Indian Marble 250 - 400/-
Granite 150 - 300/-

You can use bamboo wood flooring in bedrooms, even entry level Italian marble costs same however that was popular 10 yrs back and now solid wood flooring is what is called premium.
Solid hardwood starts at 800+ , strand-woven Bamboo is next choice finish and durability wise there is no difference from hardwood and it's eco-friendly.

Taking each bedroom to be 225 sq feet 2.7 ~ 3 lakhs for flooring upgrade.

Other option such as engineered wood is not good because it is basically MDF + veneer

About marble / granite:

South India is blessed with granite
Granite prices depends on origin and design and can range from 100 - 250 for good quality laying + nosing/cutting charges are around 50 rs so 150-250/-

Cheapest is Sadarhalli granite of Bangalore which is 65 Rs but you can see this in all BBMP works so avoidable in homes.

For areas other then bedrooms which see more footfalls granite or marble is preferable over wood.

Italian marble is a weak and porous stone and if you prefer marble better to for go mid range Indian marbles like Banswara, Doongri, Katni or Morwad marbles they are hard and lasting. While these stones are cheap in north they are comparitively costly here
and work out to be 100 - 300/- in Bangalore. + 120 for diamond polish so roughly 250- 400 overall.

Real Indian Makrana marble is luxary now and is in 800 - 1000 rs range.

I would put premium flooring upgrade cost as 2.5 to 3 L ( basic tile floor is already assumed
in 40L so this is additional upgrade cost)

3. Landscaping costs - don't know yet

4. Add 2.2 to 2.5 L for 10K+ liter sump tank with good rainwater harvesting capability ( 22Rs per liter for RCC tank with inside plaster )

5. and 2.5 - 3 L for 4-5 KW hybrid solar panels with net-metering (with flin energy solar charger - invertor.)

6 Add approx 5-8 L for good quality UPVC windows / french window.

7. Add 10-12 % for other things ( approval, parapet, boundary) on top of base cost of 40L

Total - 40 + 4 + (2x4) + 2.5 + 2.5 + 8 = 65 L for finished civil work approx if you don't change slab / plinth area.

8 Woodwork : there is no upper limit, however two years back I got modular kitchen + Wardrobes with premium membrane factory finish for 3BR flat for 6 lakhs later I gave it on rent because my mind changed to independent house. So 6 to 8 L for woodwork.

9. Architect fees if you are involving an architect : budget around 5 -7 Lakhs
Other option is to buy ready-made plans for 12 - 20 K and hire a civil engineer + contractor to execute the contract.

10. Waterproofing costs ( bathrooms , tanks, foundations , roof ) and Roof surface screed : Probably 1 - 2 Lakhs

11. Termite proofing : By Agencies 7 to 21 Rs per sq feet however you can get better job done
yourself follow my thread on termite proofing .
Budget around 10K for getting material and getting done by your labor.

12. Approvals, BWSSB and BESCOM charges :
Cant predict but you can reserve some amount.

So over all you are looking at 78 - 80 L if you do not change anything in terms of area and you can tightly control the budget.

However if you change definition of premium to just mean better flooring , doors windows , better floor tiles and electrical switches may be you can finish in 50 - 55 L.

Many people have some other definitions of premium and costs can cross 1 cr also.

PS: Many contractors will show lot less costs however in disorganized small house construction
business many things are hidden and cost quoted is generally the part 1 ( 40L) with Aluminium channel windows and flush doors without cost of approvals, BWSSB, BESCOM , sump , parapet and boundary wall.

[gautham]

Hi Visualizer. Thanks a ton for such a detailed response. You are amazing. Actually my definition of premium was flooring, bathroom etc . Now I get what you are saying. I need to hire an architect. Otherwise it would be a typical boxy sort of a design.
Any idea how long will this kind of a construction take ? ( g + 1. 3 bed bed room.). I know it all depends on the contractor. But on an average, how long will it take?. More than an year?. Thanks again for all your inputs.

[Visualizer]

Not sure about timelines only thing I can say is after initial experience is that whatever timeline contractors quote take it with buckets of salt and multiply mentally by 1.5 for best case scenario.

One more tip I can give from my experience is that while choosing design if you can keep span of roof slabs to 12 feet max you will save a lot of money. For larger spans to prevent columns and beams in interior, reinforcements and slab thickness goes up and to support it foundation cost also shoots up.